Accepting Jesus into your heart
I can remember when I had just become a Christian as a young man and was "gung ho" about evangelism. Boy, I tell you what, I'd "witness" to a tree if I thought it could recite the sinners prayer. In that same vein of thinking I also worried about my future children: Would they - at that strange and ethereal "age of accountability" - accept Jesus into their hearts and become a Christian? I can even remeber being counseled to pray for my future kids.
Well, now here I am.
My kids have been listening (alot since we have been living in our van so much these days) to "Adventures in Odyssey", a childrens radio drama series put out by Focus on the Family. For the most part they are great (there was even one episode in which monsticism was protrayed in a positive light - which astounded me), but yesterday I heard an episode in which a young boy raised in a Christian home "becomes" a Christian and accepts Jesus into his heart.
I worried this might confuse my kids who are generally expected not to let Jesus out of their hearts as opposed to having to invite Him where we might think he'd never been before. Furthermore, as best as it might be conceived anyway, we repent daily...we ask God to daily "come into our hearts" (...come and abide in us...).
We are born Christians, and we are brought immediately into the Church, into the community of the faithful. We Orthodox even bring them to the table of our Lord, inviting them to be nurtured by God Himself - a mystery far beyond the saying of the "sinners prayer" (which, we also say before approaching the "dread sacrifice").
I suppose a simple comparative analogy would be the Protestant wedding service and the Orthdoox wedding service: we do not have vows. Whereas in a protestant context you aren't married until you have said the vows...imagine for a moment a protestant wedding that skips the vows? Did anything really happen?
What are words worth anyway? A newborn infant cannot speak, cannot "decide" - so we assume. And yet God's love is not truly visited upon them until they are able to do these things? Or at least God's love is in a sort of default mode that changes somehow when the magical "age of accountability" arrives? I do not understand this.
How wonderful the mysteries of the Church are (which I am much more comfortable not fully understanding)! "Suffer the little children to come unto me and forbid them not, for of such is the kingdom of God" In my experience, the world of children is made up of magic, mystery, and wonder. We Orthodox raise them precisely in that from day number one.
And so, we pray not that our children will GO, but that our children will STAY amongst the magical, mysterious, and wonderful love of our God.
May we adults learn to stay too.
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I admit to saying all of this out of the fear that I will not give my children every opportunity to walk on the path of repentance. I understand my obligation to them is to be a living catechism, but seeing what I have with many children growing up and leaving, only to return for Pascha once a year, I'm willing to really be honest and look at whatever means are necessary to aid and guide my children.
I'm probably missing something really obvious hear, so help me out.
And I envision that as being both a formal/traditional education as well as experiential through the services, the prayers, the life of the Church.
My point is that a 13 year old who prays the following: "Lord Jesus I know that I am a sinner and that you died for my sins. I accept you and ask you to come into my heart" is no more or less saved than my four year old who can only say: "I love God" or even an infant who can say nothing at all.
Knowledge isn't salvation...love is. Evangelicalism seems to say of kids: We need to prepare them to become Christians...whereas Orthodoxy says, I think, We need to prepare them to remain Christians.
The difference may be subtle, but hearing the evangelical undertsanding of the typical/expected "salvation experience" on the radio program made me cringe a little as my kids listened. It is a different understanding.
Meg, the "Sinner's Prayer" isn't set in stone, nor really written except in evangelical tarcts. It is more a loose formula to be used to "become a christian" and usually follows a pattern as you may see in the example above: 1. Admit you are a sinner. 2. Acknowledge that Jesus died for your sins. 3.Accept Him and ask Him into your heart.
That's a pretty typical pattern you'll see...but they may vary.
In a VERY serious way, the pre-communion prayers are VERY similar...except in their overarching context. And that may be the connection I will provide for my kids if a question arises: Yes, we say the sinner's prayer before communion...just as we LITERALLY take Jesus into our hearts.
beautiful.
Bravo, sir.
Our background is Protestant via the "mega-church". For years we have wrestled with all the varying theologies, the lack of reverence in our church's services, and the feeling that we really haven't grown much closer to Jesus in all our years in church.
As we've been praying and giving conversion most of our time and thoughts, my heart has been hurting for our daughter. I feel that our church has been so good to her and she has so much fun and feels safe there and really looks forward to it. I just don't want her to grow up feeling that church is boring and then never want to go and her not embracing the Lord. At least this is my thinking for the time being and I have years and years of this thinking engrained in me. But I know I must obey the Lord in His leading us. I need to get out of my box and realize that faith is more than a church service and we will be modeling faith to her. I love this:
"And so, we pray not that our children will GO, but that our children will STAY amongst the magical, mysterious, and wonderful love of our God."
Thanks for this perspective, it comforts me immensely.
(Still getting used to the idea of having my little one by my side for an entire church service.) :)
Peace to you,
Lauren
I wrote an article recently in which I stated that I would not presume to say the child who sings, or says, "come into my heart Lord Jesus" does not have Jesus in his/her heart at that time and for always if they so continue to choose. I had a dearly beloved cousin who died at age 96. She followed Jesus as closely as possible, living an entire life in service and love in whatever areas presented themselves. When she was in her 90s (and incidentally still serving those around her) we had a conversation in which she said, "I do not remember a time in my life when I did not believe in Jesus as my Savior and Lord." She was wondering if somehow that was wrong. My response was that I, too, do not remember a time when I did not believe, having been raised in a home where Jesus was at the center.
There are theological differences between those who baptize infants to take away original sin, and then bring them up step by step in a knowledge and expression of the faith, and those who believe that infants are not cursed with original sin (merely a sinful human nature) and therefore ask that a child make that decision at a particular pre-determined age. Those who believe as the Orthodox Christians do will pray that they never leave. Those who believe that only after the age of accountability can they make that decision will then pray that they come back.
Not all protestant denominations believe in infant baptism followed by catechism and confirmation, but many do. In very general terms, those denominations which arose from the Roman Catholic tradition carry that theology with them only differing in matters of church law. Those which arose from other theological traditions have differing beliefs when it comes to the age of accountability, infant baptism, confirmation, etc.
Foremost in all of us, though, is the belief in God, belief in our Savior, Jesus Christ, belief in the presence and guidance of the Holy Spirit (or Holy Ghost) and belief in the need to attempt to bring all human beings into fellowship with Christ. This includes our own children, their children, and onto generations of believers and followers.
To do this, we need to prayerfully repent of our sins and live in such a way that we do not mirror behavior which would bring dishonor to our faith, as it is true that people without faith will judge our faith by those of us who proclaim it, and will watch our daily actions when we are unaware they are doing so.
Carol
Welcome! Glad to hear you and yours are following "the Ancient Landmarks which your Fathers have set."
If you stick around I implore you to remember that I am a sinful jerk who is liable to write some stupid things and so don't let it color your opinion of the Church. Holy Orthodoxy is beautiful and I never do it justice.
I will be honest and tell you that there were times when I first started attending Orthodox services that I thought there was no way I could do it (I have four small kids). But, I stuck with it and in time I discovered a number of things:
1. It can be done...it's hard but it can be done.
2. Kids LOVE Orthodox services. Yes, they really do...maybe its just my kids but they really do seem to appreciate the formality, the "pictures", the "uniforms", the smells, the bells, the tastes etc etc etc. Yes they hate having to be still and quiet, but the service DOES mesh with them on a deeper level.
Sometimes it is still hard, but as the kids get older they begin to "tame" themselves naturally and I watch as the younger ones grown into the "trouble/noise makers".
Every kid will grow to be bored of church...expect them to tell you that they hate church from time to time. Maybe...just maybe...if I were a better parent and better Orthdoox Christian I would hear that less often, I dunno.
But I have seen very profound expressions of faith in my littlest ones and I think that the nature and praxis of Orthodoxy facilitates that wonderfully.
Something as simple as a baby choosing to sleep with their favorite icon.
http://ferrenbergfotos.blogspot.com/2005/11/now-i-lay-me-down-to-sleep.html
you wrote:
There are theological differences between those who baptize infants to take away original sin, and then bring them up step by step in a knowledge and expression of the faith, and those who believe that infants are not cursed with original sin (merely a sinful human nature) and therefore ask that a child make that decision at a particular pre-determined age.
Well, and this is where it gets REALLY interesting...because what you describe here is more specific to the RCC/Protestant debate on the issue. The Eastern Church actually has a fairly different understanding of "original sin"
The west traditionally emphasizes a legal analogy with regard to salvation...whereas the east does not.
So, the idea that GUILT in inherent in original sin is really what fuels the debate on whether or not babies are inherit original sin. For the Orthodox we would prefer to say that what is inherent in "original sin" (i.e. that which we inherit) is primarily mortality.
So based on this understanding, there is no such thing as an "age of accountability" with regard to salvation, if there were then babies (or anyone under the age of 12 or so) would never die.
Since clearly they do die, they need salvation just like the rest of us.
The RCC/Protestant dichotomy simply does not exist in the Orthodox way.
It's a tired anaology, I know, but no less true I think. The Orthodox see salvation more in terms of a medical analogy as compared to a legal one. We need healing...real and true healing from death itself...NOT just a proclamation of innocence based on someone else taking our punishment.
Remember:
Christ is Risen from the dead, trampling down death, by death. And upon those in the tombs, bestowing Life.
The saying that the Protestants and Catholics have more in common with each other than the Orthodox have with either may in fact be true...at least in some areas.
2. Aaron, good to see you post! Hit me up when the next Sunday night group is with the new book (thomas@rhetoricalanswers.com)
3. Lauren S? Is that you! If it is... WOW! I miss you too!
Look forward to seeing you.
Hi Thomas, yes it is I. Please don't say anything to anyone. We haven't told a soul except for Matt (who is the orthodox friend I mentioned.) We are still very involved and want to leave as gracefully as possible. It's weird for me to even say "leave". I'm worried, excited, unsure, but also at peace if that makes any sense.
Lauren
I was raised to believe that I had to live my faith, all of my life, and that I needed to sincerely repent of all sins, of commission and omission, and those I cannot see or remember, and beg for forgiveness. I have never believed that no matter what I do, I will be forgiven without sincere repentence and without striving not to repeat those sins. That fits in much more closely with the fact that Jesus removed and conquered death with his own death, than the idea that once you believe, he has paid for all of your sins, including those in the future.
Very deep thoughts, these, but I really appreciate your clarification of my response. I admire the way you and SusanSophia model your putting your faith first in your lives.
Carol
You are far too kind!
I am a dismal failure in so many ways. Any good that you happen to see I must give credit to WHERE I have placed myself and my family (i.e. within the context of Paradosis - tradition) rather than any grand effort on my part.
@ Aaron: I am not pious enough for St. Igantius! Actually... I just have a lot of stuff going on and also I hate coming in during the middle of a study.