An Imperialist, Occupier, and enemy of Islam....

...prepares to slaughter another innocent Iraqi family.



Keep in mind that when those cowardly steaming piles of fecal matter were taking shots at our boys and girls (as the terrorist propaganda film broadcast by CNN showed), they were doing horrible things like this picture depicts.

Comments

Meg said…
Where do you find these evil photographs? They illustrate in such graphic detail the horror of imperialist occupation of a peace-loving, Allah-fearing nation. (OK, Meg, you can power down on the irony a bit.)
joel said…
Is it propaganda if it differs from your point of view, or could you also consider this propaganda?

"..prepares to slaughter another innocent Iraqi family."

Are you saying that it didn't happen? Or, are you simply suggesting that the images depicted on the news are not balanced? Because that's not news. But US soldiers killing civilians is.

James, this post makes me laugh. It's not that getting rid of Saddam was a bad thing, or that people actually believe that we hate Islam, it's the mere fact that for the past year our government has been telling the world that we're only seeing a small fraction of reality; that Iraq isn't as violent as is shown on TV. Well, as has been stated for quite some time, and now varified by the generals in charge and on the ground, things are pretty bad, and we have to accept some of the blame. And while it's true that the infrastructure in Iraq is in shambles due in part to the insurgency, it can also be stated that the various agencies incharge of the rebuilding process have failed and their practices have been venal at best. The overhead that you and i have been paying for the little progress is clear example of this -- 20 to 75%, that's some cash.

Therefore, why post stuff like this? I mean, are you suggesting that it's all roses over there? I mean, i live in berkeley, and from the people i talk to, no one would suggest that good isn't happening, but they would question the veracity of our governments claims, especially since their track record for accurate descriptions for political means illuminates their shady character.
fdj said…
What is my point of view?

I post it, Joel, precisely because balance is important. Frankly neither you or I know much about daily life in Iraq - few of us do.

Is it news? Of course it is news - unless you buy into the "if it bleeds it leads" corporate idea of what is news. If the vast majority of our soldiers are having very positive relationships with most of the Iraqi people...well I'd like to know that.

I recently interviewed a candidate for a job. He's ex-Army (had to leave due to health issues) and he told me that he has A LOT of friends who have been and are over there. He confirms that we are not getting a fair picture of what is happening there. EVERYONE of his friends who have returned have actually WANTED to go back. So if that is true, then clearly we don't know the whole story.

I also post it because I grow weary of hearing NOTHING but bad news happening to and bad behavior being done by our troops. And I'm far more interested in the men and woman in boots than our government's claims. And I am certainly WAY WAY more interested in the troops' story than the story of those who so hate GW that they secretly grow warm and fuzzy as they hear the US body count rising - terribly hopeful for failure, no matter the cost. Those who see the sniper film and instead of feeeling anger at the idiot shouting "Allahu Akbar" and sadness for the loss of another US soldier, they feel glee for believing their poltical opinion is verified.

If the insurgency were not there busily slaughtering policemen, teachers, woman, children, market goers, and girls trying to go to school and trying to insight sectarian violence by blowing up 'non-muslim' muslims, and trying to destroy a duly elected democratic government...well I'd say things would be a lot better on all fronts for the Iraqi people. The insurgent cause is evil and their methods are evil. To say otherwise shows a profound and dangerous ignorance of what their cause actually is.

Whatever the various "agencies in charge" or the US government or our boys and girls in boots have done or failed to do, does not even come close to comparing to what the insurgents are doing. I hold them FAR FAR FAR more culpable to the mess there than us.

We need to stop treating the poeple there as if they have no freewill. As if we must always be the ones at fault when THEY kill innocent people. That we must be the ones at fault when THEY do terrorists acts.

Yes, let us be accountable for our failures...and we have been. We have prosecuted our own people when they go over the line. But let THEM be accountable for the evil that IS their policy.

I have no doubts about who the good guys are and who the bad guys are over there. This picture reminds me of that, just like Michael Yon's beautiful and sad photo of a US soldier weeping as he carries a shattered little Iraqi girl who was blown up by another insurgent bomb.

Joel, as I find more of these photos I will continue to post them. I think it is very important that the image of our troops killing civilians is NOT the endruing image we have. It's unfair to the vast vast majority of them who are there trying to do good. I'm sorry you do not appreciate that.
joel said…
James,
I agree the media notion of "if it bleeds it leads" is dangerous. But I find statements like this:

"Whatever the various "agencies in charge" or the US government or our boys and girls in boots have done or failed to do, does not even come close to comparing to what the insurgents are doing. I hold them FAR FAR FAR more culpable to the mess there than us."

to be, as well. So the discusions regarding troop levels and lack of an infrastructure (that we ARE culpable for) have had no affect on the growing insurgency? And the continued rhetoric spewing from Washington has far more to due with what the press shows than their distaste for GW. If our President continues to contradict himself, do you think the media has the obligation to confront that? Or is this war on terror too important for democracy? And your insinuation that people get all giddy with pleasure at the sight of another soldiers death is just a perverted. But hey, I not unlike you really can't speak for others and how they 'truly' feel about anything. So, you suggestion is emotional, not rational.

I think the issue of cut and run is a non-issue, it's GW's strategy. People want him to admit his miscues, because he's so apt to spin what's going on there.

As for your interviewee/interlocuter, guys like him should be commended, but living near camp Pendelton allowed me the opportunity to hear numerous sides ; and yes, i have some friends who would go back in a heart beat, and those who would not; and in each case, i support their decision. But in all cases, we have to ask are they true and accurate details of Iraq, or emotional responses? Probably both.

My issue is our government and the President. I take no joy in the death of anyone; and i definitly take offence at the insinuation. But i take more offence at the notion that i should support an administration no matter what they do because the 1% that rule this country do, truly have my best interest at heart, especially in this war on terror.

I may be an american, but my faith is not delimited by party lines or nationalism.

"It's unfair to the vast vast majority of them who are there trying to do good. I'm sorry you do not appreciate that." Oh I appreciate that, it was your use of the word propaganda i took afront too.

But as for showing the images, celebrate them instead of using them to convey your hate for certain media predilections.
fdj said…
Joel, I'm not sure you "got" my use of the word propaganda. The sniper film WAS a terrorist propaganda film...THEY said so themselves. Furthermore it was intended to be a "RECRUITING" film. I simply agreed with them.

I did not mean to imply YOU took pleasure from seeing the body count rise. But I do believe there are many people who DO so hate Bush that they cannot see past it to realize that failure in Iraq is bad for us all. Every dead marine, every media report of ongoing chaos - no matter how accurate is for them, a testimony to how right they were and how wrong Bush was.

I stand my original point, the picture had nothing - I say again: nothing to do with GW, US Policy, "cut n run", or even CNN really. It had to do with the fact that the only story we seem to get out of Iraq is a body count. I don't see where I endorsed anything here OTHER than the need for us to have a clearer picture of what our soldiers are doing over there.

That's all. If you do appreciate that, then you really have no argument with the post to begin with.
fdj said…
Let me further clairfy one point:

So the discusions regarding troop levels and lack of an infrastructure (that we ARE culpable for) have had no affect on the growing insurgency?

I say absolutely...let the heads roll. Especially where policy has sacrificed our troops safety and obviously where it has hindered overall success.

However, don't forget: political will is important as well and that - I think will be the REAL factor on which success will or will not happen. And political will comes from us average saps who usually have nothing more than the media to enlighten us to what is happening there.

Did we lose Vietnam because of poor political/military policy or did political will slowly evaporate? Did political will constantly screw up political military policy and strategy? I suspect so.

So, "it bleeds, it leads" media can also ultimately be culpable for our failure as political will dries up.

Had we a fairer picture of what was happening...what our men and women are doing, would we have more political will?

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